|
Post by Otaku on Mar 10, 2008 13:36:12 GMT 8
I finally found it! School lunches aren't meant for foreigners. ;D This passage was taken straight from MEXT's website. One thing I couldn't believe was that school lunch is not just food you eat to become full...it is also classified as 'formal education'."School lunch programs are implemented for the purpose of ensuring the healthy mental and physical development of students and contributing to an improvement in the dietary habits of the Japanese people, and are firmly established as an integral part of formal education. The unbalanced diets of children, increasing number of obese children skipping breakfast and other problems related to dietary habits have heightened the importance of food-related guidance in connection with school lunch, special activities and course teachings. On the part of MEXT some teaching aid materials for children are issued and distributed. By the way, the schools are trying to perform the hygienic management completely in order to prevent food-poisonings like the one by Entero-hemorragic e.coli O157, which caused a lot of harms in FY1996." www.mext.go.jp/english/org/formal/05d.htmI'm happy that MEXT is worried about "healthy mental and physical development of students", but what about the mental & physical problems the lunches cause many of the foreign teachers working in public schools?
|
|
|
Post by regi2 on Mar 10, 2008 13:48:26 GMT 8
School lunch is great! All the foods I would have never had if I didn't get a mixed plate(s) every day! Working with kids back home who didn't get brekkie or lunch cause their parents forgot, or were too poor, was difficult. Loss in concentration, energy and mental stability were only a couple of the problems kids face when they don't eat properly. I understand that maybe the food isn't what all foreigners would consider delicious, or maybe even eatable, but I feel strongly that the system in place for school luch is benificial for all involved, and most important for the students. Some kids here are in the same position as back home, and can you imagine their feelings when they see someone discard or show distaste in the food which may be their first or only decent meal for the day? Maybe the reason the ALTs and teachers must eat the same lunch is to reinforce that eating a balanced meal, is really important; for everyone, regardless of culture or age.
|
|
yopparaisaru
Englipedia Fana
I drink copious amounts of fire and piss excellence
Posts: 312
|
Post by yopparaisaru on Mar 10, 2008 13:57:23 GMT 8
I agree with Otaku on this... Mostly because my lunch today consisted of noodles in a dark soup in which i ate the noodles and a plate of shrimp and some undeterminable green vegetable that tasted rancid. Oh also no milk cause I'm lactose intolerant. So just noodles today for me. Top that with not eating breakfast, cause like many Americans I don't wake up early enough to be bothered with making breakfast. That I haven't eaten in the morning since JHS. So while there may be this huge push for breakfast I can tell you that I never lack for energy in the morning. Even without caffeine. (of which I am a huge addict) hurray caffiene gum for those mornings when i don' even have time to steep tea or brew coffee. w00t!
I am also glad that MEXT is concerned about the welfare of the students by giving them a healthy lunch, but if they really want to embrace the whole international cultural thing, maybe they should include some western/non-japanese food every so often. I know just knowing that maybe just once a month or so i could eat a "real" lunch it would make me a lot happier. And with the enthusiasm i see the japanese kids shovel food into their mouths I'm sure they wouldn't mind something different either.
|
|
|
Post by Otaku on Mar 10, 2008 14:55:02 GMT 8
Some kids here are in the same position as back home, and can you imagine their feelings when they see someone discard or show distaste in the food which may be their first or only decent meal for the day? Regi, Don't get me wrong...I have much respect for you. But, I have 3 things to say about the passage from your previous post. 1. You're trying to compare a collective based society with western societies which focus more heavily on the individual. I will agree that SOME families in Japan might be classified as 'poorer' but I wouldn't say that I've ever seen a poor Japanese family. Coming from our more 'western societies' that focus more on capitalism and every person making their own living, I don't think anybody is going to argue that there is a bigger social-economic divide in our own countrys' (sp?) economy than Japan's. While there might be a distinct and visible line back home when classifying a 'poor' family, I would argue that the line is less obvious in Japan, a collective society that works together for the good of the whole. While I will agree there are 'less wealthy' families that exist in Japan, I would hardly go to the extreme that a family is so poor they go without breakfast, especially when there are 3 generations living under the same roof and everybody has some connection to a farmer, which provides Japan's staple food. Additionally, how can breakfast deprived students not have enough money for breakfast but still pay for school lunch? If they must choose between breakfast or lunch, isn't breakfast the most important meal of the day? Also, if these breakfast deprived families exist, not to be their accountant or anything, but I would suggest switching from Japanese rice to ANY OTHER COUNTRY'S RICE where the government doesn't control the price just to protect the small farmer. Doing so would allow the student the opportunity for breakfast and save them about 1/3 the money. 2. However, even if we ignore everything up to this point, let's for hypothetical reasons say there are many families that can't even supply their children with breakfast, let's talk about the second problem I see. If these poor children are disheartened by the fact that I don't eat natto or 100+ types of fish in various cooked stages, they need to be educated that NOT EVERYONE IS THE SAME! I think Japanese children need to be educated to this piece of factual information. I don't buy the 'gaman' attitude of choking down a 'food' that genuinely produces a gag reflex. I think what a lot of people forget is how much many foreigners already gaman-ly eat things we normally wouldn't eat back in our own country. 3. I'll even take this one step further. Let's grant there are breakfast deprived students who shouldn't know there are different types of people in the world. Let's say these students actually exist and they are emotionally distraught when the non-Japanese foreigner comes in and scrunches up their nose to the fact they are once again served those little white fishes with the the eyeballs and skeletons still in tack for the fifth time that particular week. I would argue that these students actually LOVE the fact that I don't like the food because that means they are receiving an 'omori' helping that day. I would argue the poor children like me MORE, NOT LESS for not liking school lunch...
|
|
|
Post by gumby on Mar 10, 2008 15:42:03 GMT 8
I don't know if Japanese lunches are all that bad. Personally I don't care for a lot of the food myself, but after taking a look at my niece's US school lunch menu, there is no denying Japanese lunches are healthier. Pizza every Friday with the main vegetable being potatoes or a salad bar students may or may not choose to eat from.
As to comments about students too poor to eat breakfast, I don't know how many are too poor, but I do know there are a lot of studentsĀ@who don't eat breakfast. Who knows the reason, gets up late, parents don't bother to make breakfast etc. There is the occasional student who is left to find their own dinner as well.
I am lucky, though, because my town supposedly has good food. I wouldn't know since I've never eaten in another district but that's what I hear from other teachers.
There are those days when the leftover tin is quite heavy. The town nutritionist says that she almost expects this. She purposely doesn't serve only food that students like. She wants them to at least try different foods and become aware of the different nutritional elements.
I don't think that students should be forced to eat everything, but they should at least attempt to eat it. And if there is a bad lunch day, I doubt students will be going hungry if they don't finish their plate.
at least that's my two bits
|
|
|
Post by gumby on Mar 10, 2008 15:46:57 GMT 8
One last comment. There is a big problem now of parents NOT paying for school lunch. This is not a matter of menu. The marority of these parents are not providing sack lunches or bentos. I've heard of cases where the school tries to get them to pay, and the parents tell them, 'to not feed their kids lunch'!
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 11, 2008 8:03:11 GMT 8
I really care less either way, I just wish they would stop with the annoying 'let's eat this deliciously because we are Japanese and it's full of iron that's good for your blah blah' brainwashments during lunch.
I'm pretty sure the kids tune it out for the most part, but I wonder, if they had the choice, would they choose to have those announcements made to them, or would they mind a little more music to help them relax during their day?
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 11, 2008 8:06:25 GMT 8
I agree with Otaku on this... Mostly because my lunch today consisted of noodles in a dark soup in which i ate the noodles and a plate of shrimp and some undeterminable green vegetable that tasted rancid. Oh also no milk cause I'm lactose intolerant. So just noodles today for me. Top that with not eating breakfast, cause like many Americans I don't wake up early enough to be bothered with making breakfast. That I haven't eaten in the morning since JHS. So while there may be this huge push for breakfast I can tell you that I never lack for energy in the morning. Even without caffeine. (of which I am a huge addict) hurray caffiene gum for those mornings when i don' even have time to steep tea or brew coffee. w00t! I am also glad that MEXT is concerned about the welfare of the students by giving them a healthy lunch, but if they really want to embrace the whole international cultural thing, maybe they should include some western/non-japanese food every so often. I know just knowing that maybe just once a month or so i could eat a "real" lunch it would make me a lot happier. And with the enthusiasm i see the japanese kids shovel food into their mouths I'm sure they wouldn't mind something different either. you have been exalted for this post. woot back atcha.
|
|
|
Post by dickflem on Mar 11, 2008 11:32:47 GMT 8
I think of food in a spectrum. Like many things I think of.
At one end: tastes really good but is very unheathy.
At the other end: very healthy, but tastes very bad.
The food served in school is usually very healthy, and it's something different almost everyday. It sometimes fail to deliver to the taste bud department. I understand only to well as last week I had the misfortune of Natto, twice.
However, I think that most of us come from countries where we had a chioce of a selection of foods. I think it's natural for us to yearn not only for those foods but also the right to choose what we want to eat for lunch.
However, I think what is important for me is to sometimes think of food in terms of utility and not pleasure. The food we get at school serves a good purpose - healty and sustenance. While it may not be conducive to your taste buds, it's cheap, clean and usually good for you.
The majority of children in the world don't have access to a balanced diet nevermind foods that taste good. I think it's good to eat humble pie sometimes.
|
|
|
Post by Otaku on Mar 11, 2008 12:20:48 GMT 8
I think of food in a spectrum. My spectrum is lost in the 'Twilight Zone'! However, I think what is important for me is to sometimes think of food in terms of utility and not pleasure. I find this virtually impossible to think of food as a 'utility' living in a country that fetishly thinks about food. The majority of children in the world don't have access to a balanced diet nevermind foods that taste good. I think it's good to eat humble pie sometimes. I like shepard's pie better. Can we eat that sometimes?
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 11, 2008 12:55:55 GMT 8
I don't know which I fear more... the Japanese fetish for food and eating it in front of a live audience who ritually coos, or... Cosplish.
|
|
|
Post by hellndie on Mar 11, 2008 13:13:32 GMT 8
However, I think what is important for me is to sometimes think of food in terms of utility and not pleasure. The food we get at school serves a good purpose - healty and sustenance. While it may not be conducive to your taste buds, it's cheap, clean and usually good for you. I had a discussion with a colleague a while back about food. He actually suggested "food pill" as a replacement for actual food. In other words, people would take those food pills to get the protein/nutrition rather than deciding what is healthy or not to eat. I, on the contrary, believe that food is something we need to eat to survive but we should also decide for ourselves what we want or don't want to eat. Afterall, we live in a FREE world. Eating is suppose to be something you enjoy doing, a pleasure, a relaxing moment; hence all the candlelight dinners, wine with the meal, "sit back, relax and enjoy your meal" phrases. Somehow eating in Japan seems to be a punishment for those who are given food that they know for a fact that they don't like. As far as I know, none of my students can bring their own lunches to school on a non-bento day. Every student needs to eat the same school lunches with their fellow classmates. That is to say that whether they like the food or not, they have to eat it. When one person (the nutritionist or MEXT , etc) decides on what students have to eat to classify as "eating healthy," it deprives students of their freewill and their independence. In the Japanese culture, 'freewill' probably doesn't exist but what about "survival of the fitness" or "being independent"? What will happen to these 13-14 years old when they are out of schools with no nutritionists or mothers who would tell them everyday what is healthy to eat? "You dont give a hungry man a fish, instead you teach him how to fish." Doesn't this apply to Japanese students as well? You don't tell them what is healthy (if healthy food is the main concern for eating in this country), you teach them how to distinguish what is healthy or not. The next issue is the word, "heathy." Who gets to decide what is healthy to eat and what is not? Take milk for an example, people say that it is really healthy and important that children drink milk everyday. What about those who are lactose? Milk apparently is NOT healthy for them. Take meat for another example, some people think it is healthy while others dont think so because they have a hard time digesting it or just the fact that meat isn't tasty to them. If I have to eat something I don't like, it's not healthy mentally or physically in my book. Overall, I believe that students should be encouraged to try all the food but should be given the choice to eat them or not.
|
|
|
Post by regi2 on Mar 11, 2008 14:08:39 GMT 8
I am aware that everyone is different in what they may enjoy to eat, however, what children need to be educated in, is not the to be so freakin picky about their foods. I agree as much as the next that food should be enjoyable, but I also believe that it is important to exposed to a variety of foods so as to open our eyes and tastebuds to things that may seem strange. If we just ate what we wanted, we'd miss out on so much exposure to new things. I have come in contact with many people who are so picky about their food, it makes me sick.
School lunch is as much about developing a view that 'everyone is different'; moreso than having a foriegner on display in the lunch room screwing up their face at food. Showing what is available and that not everyone likes the same food, but also respecting that food is a precious resource and we are damn lucky to have it.
I guess when you go through the situation of not having food to eat, school lunch is great. I am not going to discuss the other points made about 'children being poor'. There may not be MANY families; but why add to the embarrassment of the ones who may need the lunch (for whatever reason).
If school lunch is such a BIG problem for the mental and physical health of foriengers, then how are they surviving in a place where the food is different to what we eat back home? How can we say that we recognise that 'everyone is different' and have an attitude to judge that what Japanese choose to eat for lunch (or any time) is wrong?
|
|
|
Post by Otaku on Mar 11, 2008 14:35:40 GMT 8
I whole heartedly agree that people should be exposed to different foods. However, when you see 'different' food, let me know! The same 'ol crap is served all the time. Just because they move those little white fishes with the eyeballs still in them over from the salad and put it in the rice, doesn't make a new type of food. Hellndie mentioned something about who is going to teach the students what is okay to eat after they graduate from school? Not to play devil's advocate, but you could almost argue that students don't need to learn because the society on a whole regulates food consumption. For example, when McDonald's new 1,000 calory burger came out, they refused to serve it after a certain time at night because of health reasons. People can't necessarily decide what they want to eat all the time in this country. What I find EXTREMELY ironic is the concern put into 'eating healthy' with tobacco vending machines on every corner. If school lunch is such a BIG problem for the mental and physical health of foriengers, then how are they surviving in a place where the food is different to what we eat back home? How can we say that we recognise that 'everyone is different' and have an attitude to judge that what Japanese choose to eat for lunch (or any time) is wrong? That's the point I'm trying to make. This country is all about surviving....not living! Like someone said above, eating should be a Also, when foreigners make comments about school lunches being crap, it's not like the rest of the students are sitting around saying, "This lunch is delicious!" If people paid more attention to the students, they would realize that the vast majority of the students don't like the food either. I took a survey while I was eating lunch with my 2nd graders in JHS. I asked them how many of them TRUELY like those little white fishes with the eyeballs(shirasu and chirimenjako). About 95% did that patented tilt-the-head-to-the-side-and-suck-air-thru-the-teeth move, which basically means if they didn't have the peer pressure from all around them, they would opt out of eating it. When I make comments about school lunch, most of the time, the students are right there beside me thinking what I'm actually openingly expressing. You can easily see this is true when I try to give away my lunch and nobody else wants it...until the lunch is curry or some type of meat, then there's an all out war just to keep my food on my lunch tray. Some days, I think about quitting my job and creating that 'food pill' Hellndie was talking about. It sounds like a brilliant idea!
|
|
|
Post by regi2 on Mar 12, 2008 8:33:08 GMT 8
On another note of school lunches and keeping in line with my morning TV, there is a worry about the proper use of chopsticks and that kids aren't being taught how to use them at home. It was amusing to see people pulled over and judged correct or wrong on their use of hashi.
At first I thought 'why is it so damn important if they use them the correct way? As long as thier getting the food into their mouths without stabbing it...'
How would you react if you were eating somewhere and on eof your mates grabbed a fork in a fist and started stabbing at the steak? It would be mildly amusing, but if that is truly the way they ate...
I prefer to use my hands anywho. More taste, less washing up. do you think etiquette of the usage of eating utensils is important? Is it the schools job to teach the kids?
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 12, 2008 8:49:53 GMT 8
However, I think what is important for me is to sometimes think of food in terms of utility and not pleasure. The food we get at school serves a good purpose - healty and sustenance. While it may not be conducive to your taste buds, it's cheap, clean and usually good for you. I had a discussion with a colleague a while back about food. He actually suggested "food pill" as a replacement for actual food. In other words, people would take those food pills to get the protein/nutrition rather than deciding what is healthy or not to eat. I, on the contrary, believe that food is something we need to eat to survive but we should also decide for ourselves what we want or don't want to eat. Afterall, we live in a FREE world. Eating is suppose to be something you enjoy doing, a pleasure, a relaxing moment; hence all the candlelight dinners, wine with the meal, "sit back, relax and enjoy your meal" phrases. Somehow eating in Japan seems to be a punishment for those who are given food that they know for a fact that they don't like. As far as I know, none of my students can bring their own lunches to school on a non-bento day. Every student needs to eat the same school lunches with their fellow classmates. That is to say that whether they like the food or not, they have to eat it. When one person (the nutritionist or MEXT , etc) decides on what students have to eat to classify as "eating healthy," it deprives students of their freewill and their independence. In the Japanese culture, 'freewill' probably doesn't exist but what about "survival of the fitness" or "being independent"? What will happen to these 13-14 years old when they are out of schools with no nutritionists or mothers who would tell them everyday what is healthy to eat? "You dont give a hungry man a fish, instead you teach him how to fish." Doesn't this apply to Japanese students as well? You don't tell them what is healthy (if healthy food is the main concern for eating in this country), you teach them how to distinguish what is healthy or not. The next issue is the word, "heathy." Who gets to decide what is healthy to eat and what is not? Take milk for an example, people say that it is really healthy and important that children drink milk everyday. What about those who are lactose? Milk apparently is NOT healthy for them. Take meat for another example, some people think it is healthy while others dont think so because they have a hard time digesting it or just the fact that meat isn't tasty to them. If I have to eat something I don't like, it's not healthy mentally or physically in my book. Overall, I believe that students should be encouraged to try all the food but should be given the choice to eat them or not. I'd eat a pill. And follow it up with a friggin steak!
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 12, 2008 8:57:44 GMT 8
I'd tell them to get some fuckin manners or I'm never eating with them again. Seriously.
As for Japanese kids, it's atrocious. I've seen the way these kids hold their pencils, fuck, you would think they were Neandrathals. Moreover, I'm seeing corelations between who is not holding chopsticks properly and who is not holding a pencil properly. This should say something... what exactly I'll admit to not knowing, but...
On a side note, I'm often complimented on my holding skills, and you know what?, it's not that hard to hold chopsticks (or a spoon or knife or fork) the proper way. That people can't should be an extreme embarassment to their parents.
|
|
|
Post by Otaku on Mar 12, 2008 9:37:47 GMT 8
Who is to say what is appropriate or mannerable when it comes to holding and eating utensils? Honestly, I'm offended when a Japanese person tells me how to hold chopsticks when the CHINESE invented the oversized toothpicks.
While I think changing scenarios around and trying to think about what you would find offensive back home when it comes to mannerisms, I think stabbing at a steak with a fork/knife and incorrectly resting the lower chopstick on your middle finger instead of the 'proper' 4th-finger-down are quite different scenarios.
Back to my original question, who is to say what is proper etiquette? I think spinning your fork backwards and cutting a steak is kinda weird but British etiquette says it's okay. Who sets the standards?
In India, if you use your right hand it is rude, so anybody using a fork and knife over there would have a hard time fitting into the acceptable etiquette rules. Who sets the standards?
Is there a common etiquette that everybody in the world can agree on or do you have to change your etiquette based on what country you travel to?
Let's even go smaller...post restaurants in Beverly Hills have different eating etiquette than the average restaurant. Should people change their etiquettes based upon how much they pay for their food?
'Classes'...I hate them!
|
|
|
Post by dickflem on Mar 12, 2008 13:09:08 GMT 8
Food pills? We already have vitamin supplements to compensate for the lack of nutrients in our fruit and vegetables (primarily due to intensive farming practices). I take a protein supplement to compensate for the lack of meat and beans in my typical daily diet. I have friends who are "eco-minded" vegans (I call them soap-dodgers, hippies - if you will) who eat a variety of natural supplements to maintain their health. I don't think we will reach a "soylent green" state of affairs, but we may have to look to more protracted methods of acquiring what we need if we want to be healthy. I entirely agree that food should be a pleasure, and we should decide what we want to eat. When that is possible. Is it really so bad that 4 or 5 of your meals a week are cooked, brought and presented to you by someone else? Do you not have a choice of whether to eat the school lunches or not? I know at least 2 ALTs who bring a packed lunch. I don't think the school can stop you and they probably would be too embarrassed to make a fuss about it. I agree that eating can be a pleasure. As much as being around other people, sleeping and having sex can be amazing pleasures. I think our instinctive drives are the most powerful as they are fundamentally operated on a basis of necessity, not pleasure. You sleep when you need to, not just whenever you feel like it (unless you're a JHS student in Japan). You talk to friends and family when it suits, not just whenever you feel like it (unless you're my mate Dave and you get drunken phone calls at 3.30am). You have sex when you have someone (or er.. some people) who want(s) to have sex with you and the time and the place is right. You don't just have sex whenever you feel like it unless... uh, let's leave that. With food, we eat for pleasure because it's AVAILABLE to us, all the time (in our countries). We have grown up with a system which instantly gratifies our desires for food (as long as we can pay for it). At the same time we have lost our proximity to the processes involved in food production. How many of us know how to farm vegetables or animals? As with so many things, we've gone from being producers, to being consumers. As all business minded folk know, if you want good business you create demand for things that people don't need or can't produce for themselves. If you make is on the cheap and add something that makes people come back for more, well you've got a goldmine. Is it not a good thing that schools are not just part of the same market systems that have McDonald's and KFC's signposted 5km away on major roads? I went to a school with a Coke and a Mars vending machine in the entrance hall. At lunch time the queues for those outweighed the queue for the canteen. In the same school we had a choice between healthy and unhealthy options. The majority of students chose unhealthy food everyday. In the canteen there was a coke drinks fountain. In response to this a healthy eating campaign was brought in, information, workshops on how to cook healthily. However, the vast majority of students at the end of the month long drive, decided they didn't care what was more healthy, they just craved what tasted good. I'm pretty sure that if a pupil wanted to bring a bento and didn't/couldn't eat the school lunch, the school would deny the child the right to eat they're own food. This is not a communist state. Although the means are different, these people (parents, teachers) what what they think is best for the young people. They base that on the information and discourses which they choose to consider legitimate. Same as most people. The student's have a lot of free will. They sleep in class, they choose whether or not to do the work given to them, or answer questions when asked. Being independent is a good quality but how do you define it? Would making your own lunch and bringing it to school or choosing hot dogs over hamburgers reflect your independence of thought? What do you think students would eat if you gave them a free choice? I agree that you should teach them what is healthy. I see a lot of information posters all along the corridors ranging from food awareness to gum and intestine disease (makes me hungry just looking at them). I think milk is generally pretty good for you. Unless you are lactose or have an allergy, in which case you can leave it. The calcium that milk gives young people is hard to get from other sources. What I would like to see is water on offer as well as milk. Meat rarely makes an appearance on my school lunch tray, when it does, like Otaku, I have a lot of volunteers who would happily eat it for me. If you don't like meat I'm sure it may be a inconvenience for you. Dry your eyes. Meat is murder and murder tastes good. However, I think that there most of the time the meat or fish is seperate, so it's easy to leave. I don't suggest you have to eat things you don't like, but if we only give kids food that they like, then we walk onto a very slippery slope; how many of us willingly ate all our vegetables when we were children? Is part of our role not to set an example? How would you feel if a Japanese person came to your house and screwed their face up at the thought of eating what you give them? With the exception of natto (which I intensely dislike but eat, everytime) what else is so bad? Otaku; don't look into the eyes of the fish and you'll be ok. Also, look at the state of the countries we comes from? My country (UK/Ireland) has one of the highest rates of heart disease in the EU, and is currently watching a new generation of people eat themselves to ill health, obesity and worse. "Fully two-thirds of U.S. adults are officially overweight, and about half of those have graduated to full-blown obesity... Among kids between 6 and 19 years old, 15%, or 1 in 6, are overweight, and another 15% are headed that way." www.time.com/time/subscriber/covers/1101040607/article/how_we_grew_so_big_diet01a.htmlIf 'educated' people in "free will" countries are doing this to themselves, then why should we complain when we are given decent, honest food in a country which has one of the healthiest populations in the world? I think it would be nice if the students had a choice in terms of the meals they eat, but i wonder what kind of choice would you give them? Would a set A or set B system work? Also, who comes up with the choices? Who pays for the extra labour costs of facilitating? And how much of a part does this have to play in the grand scheme of things? www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19420597-2703,00.html Also, i reckon food etiquette entirely depends on your situation. The culture and the company you are in and how much you wish to adhere to their customs is up to you. I think it's just plain good manners to try at least to attempt it. Saying that i have terrible manners when i eat with friends and family. If my friend started stabbing a steak with his fork I'd calmly take them both off him, stab him in the eye with the fork and eat his steak while he screams.
|
|
|
Post by junkdna on Mar 13, 2008 7:59:19 GMT 8
Who is to say what is appropriate or mannerable when it comes to holding and eating utensils? Honestly, I'm offended when a Japanese person tells me how to hold chopsticks when the CHINESE invented the oversized toothpicks. While I think changing scenarios around and trying to think about what you would find offensive back home when it comes to mannerisms, I think stabbing at a steak with a fork/knife and incorrectly resting the lower chopstick on your middle finger instead of the 'proper' 4th-finger-down are quite different scenarios. Back to my original question, who is to say what is proper etiquette? I think spinning your fork backwards and cutting a steak is kinda weird but British etiquette says it's okay. Who sets the standards? In India, if you use your right hand it is rude, so anybody using a fork and knife over there would have a hard time fitting into the acceptable etiquette rules. Who sets the standards? Is there a common etiquette that everybody in the world can agree on or do you have to change your etiquette based on what country you travel to? Let's even go smaller...post restaurants in Beverly Hills have different eating etiquette than the average restaurant. Should people change their etiquettes based upon how much they pay for their food? 'Classes'...I hate them! When in Rome. Also, I think an certain level of manners should be taught and expected, otherwise what's the point of eating off the table, or paying for your food at a restaurant, or being nice to people at all?
|
|
yopparaisaru
Englipedia Fana
I drink copious amounts of fire and piss excellence
Posts: 312
|
Post by yopparaisaru on Mar 13, 2008 9:48:50 GMT 8
Everyone here made some really great posts about the healthiness of school lunches and why although they may taste bad are in some way beneficial to the students. Also manners worked its way in here too, which is a total joke in JHS and ES lunch time, I mean whether or not you hold your chopsticks correctly pales in comparison to the 15 minutes of choke down whatever is in front of you as fast as you possibly can. Not limited to holding plates and shoveling food down your throat. I'm reminded of a Simpsons quote regarding Homer in his eating habits, when a character remarked, "Homer you eat like a pig! To which Marge replied in sad almost defeated voice, No, its more like a duck, pigs tend to chew..." But my main point aside from exalting dickflem for his stabbing prowess and oh so subtle grace of stealing his mates' delicious steak... Is that, are school lunches really that healthy? I mean sure plenty of veggies and rice and fish see healthy, and by all health books are considered healthy, but I think we're overlooking a major issue with these veggies, rice and fish. Everything here is most likely homegrown, which means all the water that they use to water the plants and grow the rice comes from the neon blue rivers that criscross our lovely prefecture. Now while many Japanese people will remark that the water is neon blue due to cleanliness from a noticeably lack of wild fish and plants, but Io believe its from a different reason. My belief is that the reason the water is all neon blue is because of heavy metal pollution from all the mines in the area that just dump they're waste into the rivers. Obviously mercury levels in fish have been an issue of late, and we all know how much fish the japaense eat, especially in our school lunches, where students and teachers if not happily, then resignedly crunch into the skin and skulls and brains of those fish with no hesistation whatsoever. Since its the brain tissue and skin that has the highest concentration of heavy metals just imagine how it reacts to you once you eat it. Everyday, for you whole childhood... Now, I'm not just trying to raise unwarranted concerns, I've actually did a little research into the matter and uncovered what happens to you when you eat too much mercury. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_poisoning#Signs_and_symptomsAside from the more serious signs like death and organ failure, did you notice the signs in children. Red cheeks, open sores on the hands, peeling skin. Red faces and lips, hairloss. I don't know about you, but at my schools there are at least several kids who fit that description perfectly. Even down to fact that calling someone hage! is so looked down upon. I remember in school calling someone baldy was prolly the least insult anyone could throw, but here it's apparently really bad, or at least thats how my teachers treat it whenever they hear it. My ES kids come to school with bandages on their hands, by their wrists and the bases of their thumbs, not really places you fall and scrap yourself, the tops of the hands and wrists. That would require some crazy acrobatics to flip your hands out when your falling afterall. So before i start to ramble (or maybe before i continue to ramble...) as many vitamins and minerals that you get eating these lunches, is it worth the possible heavy metal poisoning that comes along with it. While for now it seems to only affect a few kids out of the whole, maybe, but whose to say in the future, since it doesn't seem the japanese are any more willing to change their habits regarding "recycling." Burning plastics, and dumping industrial waste into the rivers and ocean where all their food comes from...
|
|
|
Post by dickflem on Mar 13, 2008 12:21:32 GMT 8
I've never seen the neon rivers but I have seen kids with similar skin problems. Though they're uncommmon among the kids in my area.
You've put me right off skin and brains at lunch though. Not that they were my favourites previously.
|
|